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Thread: Upgrading Armory/Blacksmith Chart

  1. #1

    Exclamation Upgrading Armory/Blacksmith Chart

    I found a chart/guide a while back that told you when it was effiecent to upgrade your Armory/Blacksmith vs the benefit of making another troop. I have searched for days but with no luck I haven't found it. I know the first level is somewhere around 600-700units of the same type of troop. Does anyone have this chart/guide.

    This is why when you think in the back of your head, wow I should save this. I should have really saved it :P

    (please forgive me for bad english, its not my main language)

    Thanks again for any help

  2. #2

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Woden
    Blacksmith & Armoury upgrades
    Note: These upgrades apply to all soldiers trained in that village, both before and after the upgrade.
    Formula: 1.015 ^ x; x = upgrade level
    Lv = Bonus __ Change
    _1 = + 1.50% _+1.50%
    _2 = + 3.02% _+1.52%
    _3 = + 4.57% _+1.55%
    _4 = + 6.14% _+1.57%
    _5 = + 7.73% _+1.59%
    _6 = + 9.34% _+1.61%
    _7 = +10.98% _+1.64%
    _8 = +12.65% _+1.67%
    _9 = +14.34% _+1.69%
    10 = +16.05% _+1.71%
    11 = +17.79% _+1.74%
    12 = +19.56% _+1.77%
    13 = +21.36% _+1.80%
    14 = +23.18% _+1.82%
    15 = +25.02% _+1.84%
    16 = +26.90% _+1.88%
    17 = +28.80% _+1.90%
    18 = +30.73% _+1.93%
    19 = +32.70% _+1.97%
    20 = +34.69% _+1.99%
    Hope this helps. It's from Woden's calculations guide in the faq section.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinasilna View Post
    I'm going to go postal and catapult everyone in my 801x801. No, I don't have catapults yet, but when I get them you all better watch out!

  3. #3

    Default

    Thanks for that. But I already had it

    Looked something like this

    lvl 1 - 657 macemen
    lvl 2 - 1439 macemen
    lvl 3 - 2100 macemen

    So You need 657 macemen before it would benefit you to upgrade armory.

  4. #4

    Default

    Oh. That would actually be a really interesting chart to see. If you don't manage to find it, I may try to do the calculations tomorrow.
    Quote Originally Posted by Tinasilna View Post
    I'm going to go postal and catapult everyone in my 801x801. No, I don't have catapults yet, but when I get them you all better watch out!

  5. #5
    Now, where's my pitchfork? skidoosh96's Avatar
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    Default

    wow. if you need 2100 macemen for just level 3, think what level 20 would meen.
    This is Sparta!

  6. #6

    Default

    Here is the post!

    http://forum.travian.com/showthread.php?t=104082

    I'll copy it. After 4 hrs of searching I found it. Damn keywords never work out the way I want them to :P

    Credit goes to Chaos Maker

    I did this stuff that will follow because before as far as I am aware no real guide or strategy exists for the exact number of troops u need to upgrade either defense or offense in a particular troop, and I am not just saying when to go from level 1 to level 2, I wanted to know every point where 1.5 % of ur army gains more from the upgrade rather than more troops, most of the time all I see as an answer is well u need more.

    So I did a bit of maths involving the costs to upgrade for every troop type for every tribe

    to find that 1 balancing point

    I also know that u will either upgrade offense or defense and the values I will now throw forward are based on total army sizes

    so there are some things they do not take into consideration

    these include
    The fact that if u break the army up as what usually happens in raids the bonus added here is taken with them
    The fact that the costs here are either for 1 upgrade in the armory (defense) upgrade or blacksmith(offense) upgrade [the costs of both of these are identical to each other], not both so u are not improving ur army by 1.5 % across the board just selecting one.
    It gets really complicated if u mix these 2 factors(more combinations) e.g. level 20 defense and lvl 1 off or lvl 2 off....etc

    ok firstly I want to say how I did this:

    basically I took the total cost to upgrade divided this by the cost of a single troop and u get a certain value that represents how many troops u need to reach 1.5% of ur army force

    for example:

    the clubswinger costs 250 and its first upgrade costs in total is 2310

    so if u go 2310/250 = 9.24 troops will equal 1.5 % of the army when it becomes equal value to upgrade or buy more troops as the costs are balanced at that point

    now u take the 9.24 and u multiply it by the numbers u would need to work out 100% of the army in and thats the number of troops that make up 1.5% (9.24) multiplied by 100/1.5.

    that means a clubswinger results are as follows for level 1:

    9.24*100/1.5 = 616 clubswingers before its worthwhile to upgrade from level 0 to level 1

    I used the estimated formula rather than the exponential one simply because I only wanted a good estimate(explains the 1.5 %)

    let me know what u guys think, thanks

    I will start with the Teutons

    (Clubswinger)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 616
    1 1072
    2 1482.666667
    3 1868
    4 2232
    5 2584
    6 2921.333333
    7 3252
    8 3572
    9 3886.666667
    10 4194.666667
    11 4497.333333
    12 4794.666667
    13 5088
    14 5376
    15 5661.333333
    16 5942.666667
    17 6220
    18 6494.666667
    19 6768
    20 7037.333333

    (Spearman)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 576.4705882
    1 1002.941176
    2 1388.235294
    3 1748.039216
    4 2089.215686
    5 2417.647059
    6 2734.313725
    7 3042.156863
    8 3342.156863
    9 3637.254902
    10 3926.470588
    11 4207.843137
    12 4487.254902
    13 4761.764706
    14 5031.372549
    15 5297.058824
    16 5560.784314
    17 5822.54902
    18 6077.45098
    19 6333.333333
    20 6584.313725


    (Axeman)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 542.8571429
    1 944.8979592
    2 1306.802721
    3 1645.578231
    4 1966.666667
    5 2276.190476
    6 2575.510204
    7 2864.62585
    8 3148.29932
    9 3425.170068
    10 3696.598639
    11 3963.265306
    12 4225.170068
    13 4483.673469
    14 4738.095238
    15 4989.115646
    16 5236.734694
    17 5481.632653
    18 5723.809524
    19 5963.265306
    20 6201.360544


    (Scout)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 570.3703704
    1 994.4444444
    2 1374.074074
    3 1728.703704
    4 2067.592593
    5 2391.666667
    6 2705.555556
    7 3010.185185
    8 3308.333333
    9 3600
    10 3885.185185
    11 4163.888889
    12 4438.888889
    13 4709.259259
    14 4976.851852
    15 5240.740741
    16 5501.851852
    17 5760.185185
    18 6013.888889
    19 6265.740741
    20 6515.740741

    (Paladin)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 252.0729685
    1 438.1426202
    2 606.6334992
    3 763.5157546
    4 912.7694859
    5 1056.053068
    6 1195.024876
    7 1329.684909
    8 1460.696517
    9 1589.386401
    10 1715.422886
    11 1839.137645
    12 1960.862355
    13 2080.597015
    14 2198.6733
    15 2314.759536
    16 2430.182421
    17 2543.615257
    18 2655.721393
    19 2767.495854
    20 2877.280265

    (Teutonic Knight)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 163.715847
    1 285.0273224
    2 394.5355191
    3 496.3934426
    4 593.2240437
    5 686.3387978
    6 776.8306011
    7 864.2622951
    8 949.2896175
    9 1032.786885
    10 1114.754098
    11 1195.191257
    12 1274.098361
    13 1351.912568
    14 1428.852459
    15 1504.480874
    16 1579.234973
    17 1653.114754
    18 1726.120219
    19 1798.251366
    20 1869.945355

    (Ram)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 162.7906977
    1 283.3333333
    2 391.8604651
    3 493.6046512
    4 589.9224806
    5 682.751938
    6 772.2868217
    7 859.1085271
    8 944.1860465
    9 1027.131783
    10 1108.527132
    11 1188.565891
    12 1267.054264
    13 1344.379845
    14 1420.736434
    15 1495.930233
    16 1570.348837
    17 1643.992248
    18 1716.472868
    19 1788.372093
    20 1859.496124

    (Catapult)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 79.95169082
    1 139.2512077
    2 192.7536232
    3 242.7536232
    4 290.0966184
    5 335.5072464
    6 379.7101449
    7 422.3429952
    8 464.1304348
    9 504.9516908
    10 545.0483092
    11 584.178744
    12 622.826087
    13 660.9903382
    14 698.5507246
    15 735.5072464
    16 771.9806763
    17 808.0917874
    18 843.7198068
    19 879.2270531
    20 914.1304348

    used excel so thought I would do it for a chief and settlers too just incase someone silly thinks upgrading these 2 are a good idea

    (Chief)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 116.7483231
    1 203.2691747
    2 281.1577719
    3 353.9136775
    4 423.0854477
    5 489.5217265
    6 553.7707787
    7 616.2029746
    8 677.0866142
    9 736.6345873
    10 794.9956255
    11 852.306795
    12 908.6672499
    13 964.1673957
    14 1018.883056
    15 1072.869641
    16 1126.185477
    17 1178.877224
    18 1230.988626
    19 1282.551764
    20 1333.598717

    (Settler)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 468.16
    1 815.1066667
    2 1127.426667
    3 1419.186667
    4 1696.546667
    5 1962.986667
    6 2220.613333
    7 2470.96
    8 2715.093333
    9 2953.893333
    10 3187.92
    11 3417.746667
    12 3643.76
    13 3866.32
    14 4085.706667
    15 4302.2
    16 4516
    17 4727.28
    18 4936.253333
    19 5143.04
    20 5347.746667

  7. #7

    Default

    now for the romans:

    (Legionnaire)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 551.5151515
    1 959.8484848
    2 1328.030303
    3 1671.969697
    4 1998.484848
    5 2312.121212
    6 2615.909091
    7 2909.848485
    8 3197.727273
    9 3479.545455
    10 3755.30303
    11 4025.757576
    12 4292.424242
    13 4554.545455
    14 4812.878788
    15 5068.181818
    16 5319.69697
    17 5568.939394
    18 5815.151515
    19 6059.090909
    20 6300

    (Praetorian)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 547.826087
    1 954.3478261
    2 1318.84058
    3 1660.144928
    4 1985.507246
    5 2297.101449
    6 2598.550725
    7 2890.57971
    8 3177.536232
    9 3457.246377
    10 3731.15942
    11 3999.275362
    12 4263.768116
    13 4523.913043
    14 4781.15942
    15 5034.057971
    16 5284.782609
    17 5532.608696
    18 5776.811594
    19 6018.115942
    20 6257.971014

    (Imperian)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 528.8888889
    1 921.1111111
    2 1273.888889
    3 1603.333333
    4 1916.111111
    5 2217.222222
    6 2508.333333
    7 2791.666667
    8 3067.222222
    9 3337.222222
    10 3601.666667
    11 3860.555556
    12 4116.666667
    13 4367.222222
    14 4615.555556
    15 4860
    16 5102.222222
    17 5340.555556
    18 5576.666667
    19 5810
    20 6041.111111

    (Equites Legati)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 285.1851852
    1 496.2962963
    2 687.037037
    3 863.8888889
    4 1032.407407
    5 1196.296296
    6 1352.777778
    7 1504.62963
    8 1653.703704
    9 1800
    10 1942.592593
    11 2081.481481
    12 2220.37037
    13 2355.555556
    14 2489.814815
    15 2619.444444
    16 2750.925926
    17 2879.62963
    18 3006.481481
    19 3132.407407
    20 3258.333333

    (Equites Imperatoris)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 164.3026005
    1 286.0520095
    2 395.9810875
    3 498.3451537
    4 595.5082742
    5 689.1252955
    6 779.9054374
    7 867.8486998
    8 953.427896
    9 1037.352246
    10 1119.385343
    11 1200.236407
    12 1279.432624
    13 1357.446809
    14 1434.515366
    15 1510.638298
    16 1585.579196
    17 1660.047281
    18 1733.333333
    19 1805.910165
    20 1877.777778

    (Equites Caesaris)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 121.0445469
    1 210.7526882
    2 291.2442396
    3 366.6666667
    4 438.4024578
    5 507.2196621
    6 573.8863287
    7 638.5560676
    8 701.5360983
    9 763.2872504
    10 823.655914
    11 883.1029186
    12 941.4746544
    13 998.9247312
    14 1055.913978
    15 1111.520737
    16 1166.820276
    17 1221.351767
    18 1275.576037
    19 1329.032258
    20 1381.87404

    (Battering Ram)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 162.4772313
    1 282.5136612
    2 391.0746812
    3 491.9854281
    4 588.3424408
    5 680.6921676
    6 770.1275046
    7 857.0127505
    8 941.5300546
    9 1024.225865
    10 1105.464481
    11 1185.245902
    12 1263.570128
    13 1340.801457
    14 1416.939891
    15 1491.985428
    16 1566.120219
    17 1639.526412
    18 1712.021858
    19 1783.606557
    20 1854.644809

    (Fire Catapult)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 79.82162765
    1 139.0189521
    2 192.3076923
    3 242.1404682
    4 289.4091416
    5 334.7826087
    6 378.8182832
    7 421.516165
    8 463.2107023
    9 503.9018952
    10 543.812709
    11 583.0546265
    12 621.6276477
    13 659.4202899
    14 696.9899666
    15 733.8907469
    16 770.3455964
    17 806.3545151
    18 841.9175028
    19 877.2575251
    20 912.1516165

    (Senator)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 93.38554646
    1 162.5964163
    2 224.8961671
    3 283.0948143
    4 338.4217396
    5 391.5652071
    6 442.9595348
    7 492.8966417
    8 541.5996203
    9 589.2298564
    10 635.9131363
    11 681.7562596
    12 726.8422926
    13 771.2329417
    14 814.9994067
    15 858.1820339
    16 900.8330367
    17 942.9785214
    18 984.661208
    19 1025.907203
    20 1066.742613

    (Settler)
    Level troops needed (before upgrade is considered)
    0 468.2352941
    1 815.2521008
    2 1127.605042
    3 1419.42577
    4 1696.848739
    5 1963.305322
    6 2220.966387
    7 2471.372549
    8 2715.546218
    9 2954.369748
    10 3188.445378
    11 3418.291317
    12 3644.341737
    13 3866.918768
    14 4086.358543
    15 4302.89916
    16 4516.722689
    17 4728.053221
    18 4937.058824
    19 5143.851541
    20 5348.585434

    and thats the romans

  8. #8

    Default

    finally the gauls

    (Phalanx)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 585.1851852
    1 1020.10582
    2 1408.465608
    3 1773.544974
    4 2120.634921
    5 2453.968254
    6 2775.661376
    7 3088.888889
    8 3394.708995
    9 3693.121693
    10 3986.243386
    11 4271.957672
    12 4554.497354
    13 4831.746032
    14 5106.878307
    15 5376.719577
    16 5645.502646
    17 5908.994709
    18 6170.37037
    19 6428.571429
    20 6683.597884

    (Swordsman)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 536.4485981
    1 933.9563863
    2 1291.588785
    3 1626.168224
    4 1943.925234
    5 2249.221184
    6 2544.548287
    7 2831.152648
    8 3111.52648
    9 3385.046729
    10 3652.959502
    11 3916.510903
    12 4175.077882
    13 4429.906542
    14 4680.996885
    15 4930.218069
    16 5175.077882
    17 5416.199377
    18 5656.074766
    19 5893.457944
    20 6127.102804

    (Pathfinder)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 282.4561404
    1 492.1052632
    2 680.7017544
    3 856.1403509
    4 1022.807018
    5 1184.210526
    6 1339.473684
    7 1490.350877
    8 1637.719298
    9 1783.333333
    10 1923.684211
    11 2062.280702
    12 2198.245614
    13 2332.45614
    14 2465.789474
    15 2594.736842
    16 2723.684211
    17 2851.754386
    18 2978.070175
    19 3102.631579
    20 3227.192982

    (Theutates Thunder)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 250.4587156
    1 436.0856269
    2 603.3639144
    3 759.3272171
    4 907.6452599
    5 1050.152905
    6 1188.379205
    7 1321.712538
    8 1452.599388
    9 1580.428135
    10 1705.504587
    11 1828.440367
    12 1949.541284
    13 2068.501529
    14 2185.626911
    15 2301.529052
    16 2415.902141
    17 2529.357798
    18 2640.978593
    19 2751.070336
    20 2861.16208

    (Druidrider)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 250.4587156
    1 436.0856269
    2 603.058104
    3 759.3272171
    4 907.3394495
    5 1050.458716
    6 1188.073394
    7 1322.018349
    8 1452.599388
    9 1580.428135
    10 1705.504587
    11 1828.440367
    12 1949.235474
    13 2068.501529
    14 2185.932722
    15 2301.834862
    16 2416.207951
    17 2529.357798
    18 2640.672783
    19 2751.681957
    20 2860.856269

    (Haeduan)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 161.8320611
    1 281.9338422
    2 389.9915182
    3 490.754877
    4 586.7684478
    5 678.7107718
    6 767.769296
    7 854.4529262
    8 938.9312977
    9 1021.543681
    10 1102.459712
    11 1181.849025
    12 1259.881255
    13 1337.06531
    14 1412.722646
    15 1487.701442
    16 1561.492791
    17 1634.605598
    18 1707.039864
    19 1778.625954
    20 1849.194232

    (Ram)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 162.1291449
    1 282.1989529
    2 390.4013962
    3 491.0994764
    4 587.2600349
    5 679.5811518
    6 768.7609075
    7 855.3228621
    8 939.965096
    9 1022.513089
    10 1103.490401
    11 1183.071553
    12 1261.256545
    13 1338.394415
    14 1414.485166
    15 1489.354276
    16 1563.525305
    17 1636.649215
    18 1708.900524
    19 1780.628272
    20 1851.308901

    (Trebuchet)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 79.7657082
    1 138.9776358
    2 192.0127796
    3 241.8530351
    4 289.0308839
    5 334.3982961
    6 378.3812567
    7 420.9797657
    8 462.6198083
    9 503.3013845
    10 543.1309904
    11 582.3216187
    12 620.7667732
    13 658.6794462
    14 696.1661342
    15 733.0138445
    16 769.4355698
    17 805.5378062
    18 841.1075612
    19 876.1448349
    20 911.1821086

    (Chieftain)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 116.7323424
    1 203.2400046
    2 281.1153359
    3 353.8633483
    4 423.0233898
    5 489.4503975
    6 553.6859085
    7 616.1078465
    8 676.9881323
    9 736.5249453
    10 794.8795944
    11 852.1811269
    12 908.5355456
    13 964.0281138
    14 1018.732573
    15 1072.711142
    16 1126.016822
    17 1178.70492
    18 1230.807697
    19 1282.364328
    20 1333.407075

    (Settler)
    Level number of troops(before upgrade considered)
    0 468.3113069
    1 815.3891336
    2 1127.782673
    3 1419.662261
    4 1697.107195
    5 1963.627019
    6 2221.33627
    7 2471.74743
    8 2715.991189
    9 2954.845815
    10 3188.957416
    11 3418.854626
    12 3644.919236
    13 3867.577093
    14 4087.048458
    15 4303.597651
    16 4517.444934
    17 4728.810573
    18 4937.84141
    19 5144.698972
    20 5349.471366

  9. #9

    Default different take

    Interesting. I took another approach and please tell me where my logic is off.

    Using a Roman Legionnaire for an example, the cost to get the Armoury to level one is 881 total resources. This increases the defense value of each legionnaire against infantry by .525 point.

    For 881 Resources I could have created 2 new legionnaires, which add 70 points of infantry defense.

    If I take the 70 points I could have created with two new units and divide it by .525 points per unit an upgrade adds, I get 133.48.

    Therefore, I would need 133.48 Legionnaires to get the same number of infantry defense points from a level one armory upgrade that costs 881 resources as I would for using 880 resources to make two new Legos.

    This is significantly less than your chart. Where did I go wrong?

    I also understand that there are different values for for infantry and for defense. In keeping it simple I used the lowest value. Maybe adding them together would be better?
    Last edited by jayhawk75; 05-17-2009 at 09:54 PM.

  10. #10
    My duty is to the bribe!. Ichabod_Crane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by jayhawk75 View Post
    Interesting. I took another approach and please tell me where my logic is off.

    Using a Roman Legionnaire for an example, the cost to get the Armoury to level one is 881 total resources. This increases the defense value of each legionnaire against infantry by .525 point.

    For 881 Resources I could have created 2 new legionnaires, which add 70 points of infantry defense.

    If I take the 70 points I could have created with two new units and divide it by .525 points per unit an upgrade adds, I get 133.48.

    Therefore, I would need 133.48 Legionnaires to get the same number of infantry defense points from a level one armory upgrade that costs 881 resources as I would for using 880 resources to make two new Legos.

    This is significantly less than your chart. Where did I go wrong?

    I also understand that there are different values for for infantry and for defense. In keeping it simple I used the lowest value. Maybe adding them together would be better?
    The first upgrade for the legionnaire is 3640 total resources.

    To the OP it is hard to put an exact number on when it becomes effective to upgrade units as there are many variables. If you are upgrading several types of units than the cost of the Blacksmith/armoury is deferred as opposed to upgrading just one unit. If you are using your troops in battle you will lose less as you upgrade them and that will save you troop costs. You can use the numbers as a guideline but you may have to adapt them to fit your playstyle.
    If you are reading this my post is already over, move along.

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